Aftermarket Gauges, WHAT wires to splice into? - Jeep Commander Forums: Jeep Commander Forum
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post #1 of 10 (permalink) Old 10-25-2010, 08:10 AM Thread Starter
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Aftermarket Gauges, WHAT wires to splice into?

I've installed some Autometer Gauges into my 2010 Commander, I have to splice into:

Ignition Switched Power Source

-and-

Instrument Panel Light Source

Any idea of what wires to splice into for this? Any sources for wiring schematics for 2010? (other than buying the FSM).

Yes, I am considering the ignition switched cigarette lighter, BUT, I've checked that comes on with the key in the accessory position, I would really prefer the gauges didn't come to life unless I put the key in the RUN position.

As well, all the OEM instrument lights are LED and work off some PWM scheme to dim digitally, although I think I've found a 12V source that comes on with the instrument lights, it does NOT dim with the instrument lights, I've got a feeling I won't be able to find one.
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post #2 of 10 (permalink) Old 10-25-2010, 08:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mongo View Post
I've installed some Autometer Gauges into my 2010 Commander
What gauges, and where did you install them? Pictures would be helpful. Some members have installed them in the upper dash vents. I can't help you on the wiring because the 06 has backlit gauges.
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post #3 of 10 (permalink) Old 10-25-2010, 09:00 AM
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I haven't got to any mods yet, that need an Instrument Panel light source, but I'll be in the same boat soon. (Still haven't got a service manual either). For a non dimable source I have had success tap'n the parking lights. Hope you get a good answer !

2010 Limited > 5.7> Pearl Black > QDII > 4 Superlift w-SSR > Bilstein HD Struts+1/4" spacer > RCV cv Axles > JBA 6" Springs + Matt's 1/2" Spacer > BDS adj LCA > 285-65-18 Nitto Trail Grappler MTs > Moto Metal 951 > K&N CAI > Flowmaster 50 > 4xGuard-Front/Belly skids + Grill Hoop w/ Front Receiver + Rear Diff. Guard > PIIA 520 ATP > Front Camera > Steel Armadillo's Rear Bumper/Tire /Blitz Carrier/Super Sliders + Secure Console > Dual Batteries > OBA > JKS Rear + JBA Front Discos > FlashPaq
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post #4 of 10 (permalink) Old 10-25-2010, 09:05 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dhh3 View Post
What gauges, and where did you install them? Pictures would be helpful. Some members have installed them in the upper dash vents. I can't help you on the wiring because the 06 has backlit gauges.
Well, those details don't really effect the info I need, I know how to wire up all the rest very easily. With the 2009 M/Y (maybe earlier) on going just about entirely digital for everything in the car, finding the correct circuits has proven difficult.

3 Autometer Z Series Short Sweep Electric Gauges, on the top left of the Dash, pressed up against the A pillar, in line heading inward.

Voltmeter
Trans Temp Gauge
Oil Pressure Gauge

*Power, all three wired in parrellel, need to find an Ignition Switched Source to splice into.
*Ground, all three wired in parrellel, will ground to the Engine Block.
*Sender Oil Pressure, will connect to the Autometer Sender.
*Sender Trans Temp, will connect to the Autometer Sender.
*Backlight Power, all three wired in parrellel, need to find an Dash Light Source that the voltage/power varies with Dash Light Level. I don't think I can find one (because of the way the Digital System handles LED Backlighting) and may have to settle for the source I've found, that just supplies system voltage when the lights are turned on.
*Backlight Ground, all three wired in parrellel, connected to a metal ground under the Dash.

Last edited by Mongo; 10-25-2010 at 12:12 PM.
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post #5 of 10 (permalink) Old 10-25-2010, 12:22 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by USMC View Post
I haven't got to any mods yet, that need an Instrument Panel light source, but I'll be in the same boat soon. (Still haven't got a service manual either). For a non dimable source I have had success tap'n the parking lights. Hope you get a good answer !
According to a page in the 07 FSM I could view a few pages on the internet, all the dimmable lights in the dash and interior are LED.

*LED doesn't vary light level with voltage, and don't work at all below a certain voltage (NOT 100% sure on that, but pretty sure, they work like a regular diode).

*P.O.O. says that the column knob just sends a signal to the Steering Column Control Module that you turned the knob to dim. The electronic module sends a message on the CAN network to all the devices with dimmable lights, the devices then just use PWM internally to change the light output of the LED's.

So, it sounds like to me, there is nothing varying voltage on a circuit that all the dimmable lights are tighed into. Computers are all talking to each other and agreeing to turn down the light level internally, for each device, for LED's soldered into the circuit boards. Even then, pretty sure the way you dim an LED is different than a regular bulb, you just don't turn down the voltage, that would result in the same amount of light and then it just turns off completely.

Last edited by Mongo; 10-25-2010 at 12:29 PM.
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post #6 of 10 (permalink) Old 10-25-2010, 08:13 PM Thread Starter
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Success!
The key was to plug the connectors back into the Instrument Cluster and measure the voltages with a pin stuck thru the insulation. It seems the Instrument Cluster Generates output voltages and with it disconnected I was NOT getting the proper outputs to the wiring. I was trying to measure the voltages at the connector.

On the 20 Pin Connector C2, Pin 20, the Green/Pink Stripe Wire, is Ignition Switched Voltage. Pin 15, the Orange/Black Stripe Wire (might be dark brown), is the Dimmable Light Voltage.

It appears the cluster will set its own light level according to the CAN messages, but will output a proportional voltage for other items.

You asked for pics, it was dark so the pics didn't come out well.



I still haven't installed the sensors or grounded the gauges to the engine block. So at the moment, the gauges just sit there and light up.

Last edited by Mongo; 10-25-2010 at 08:34 PM.
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post #7 of 10 (permalink) Old 10-25-2010, 09:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mongo View Post
Success! .......

On the 20 Pin Connector C2, Pin 20, the Green/Pink Stripe Wire, is Ignition Switched Voltage. Pin 15, the Orange/Black Stripe Wire (might be dark brown), is the Dimmable Light Voltage.
Wow.. Good job.!. I like to tinker w/ things from the 70's etc. thought I'd be looking for a wire coming down the steering column ha...! Appreciate the update !!, I know I will use it in the future myself.

2010 Limited > 5.7> Pearl Black > QDII > 4 Superlift w-SSR > Bilstein HD Struts+1/4" spacer > RCV cv Axles > JBA 6" Springs + Matt's 1/2" Spacer > BDS adj LCA > 285-65-18 Nitto Trail Grappler MTs > Moto Metal 951 > K&N CAI > Flowmaster 50 > 4xGuard-Front/Belly skids + Grill Hoop w/ Front Receiver + Rear Diff. Guard > PIIA 520 ATP > Front Camera > Steel Armadillo's Rear Bumper/Tire /Blitz Carrier/Super Sliders + Secure Console > Dual Batteries > OBA > JKS Rear + JBA Front Discos > FlashPaq
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post #8 of 10 (permalink) Old 10-26-2010, 06:30 AM
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Looks good man I love extra gauges


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post #9 of 10 (permalink) Old 10-26-2010, 04:29 PM Thread Starter
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thought I'd be looking for a wire coming down the steering column ha...!
Yea, NOT sure about the earlier Commanders, but now, and most cars now, it literally a bunch of computer talking to each other, telling each other what to do.

My SKEEM/FOBIK ignition system, literally has NO physical or electrical connection to the start system. There is an antenna inside the WIN box that you stick the FOBIK key into and turn, it reads the RFID chip in the key over radio waves, then sends a message to another computer to start the car.

I turn the key to start and release it immediately, doesn't matter, the Starter keeps cranking until the engine starts, even though I released the key and its back in the Run position before the motor started. Thats because I never closed the circuit to the engine starter, all I did was trip a discrete switch that told the Computer in the WIN that I wanted to start the motor, and the WIN talked to the PCM and told it to start the motor and the PCM engaged the starter motor through relays and shut it down when it recognized the motor was running.

Makes it difficult to hook up old school analog gauges.
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post #10 of 10 (permalink) Old 10-28-2010, 10:51 AM Thread Starter
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Installed my Oil Pressure Sender last night, did the wiring for the Oil Pressure Sender and the Ground. The Trans Temp is still curled up and tie-tied to the wire harness.

I posted a detailed explanation on the "Peformance Mod" board in my original thread about sender locations on the engine/trans.

The wiring is a tight fit on this vehicle, it was difficult and took hours longer than I anticipated.

The ground and two sender wires are routed through the firewall at one of the rubber plugs for a tube coming in under the brake booster. Just poked a hole in the rubber boot and pushed the wires through, sealed it with some RTV. Wrapped the wiring in electric tape, as I test routed and split the wires were necessary to their final locations. Covered it in covoluted tubing and tie-tied it to the existing wire harness.

I attached the ground to the engine block ground near the starter, sever grounds already attached there. It was tough routing the wires along the side of the motor and tie-tieing them all, I got good at doing the one-handed tie-tie, which is really tough.

The oil pressure split off and went up to the oil filter, that is where the oil pressure sensor is installed. There is a cap for an oil galley just behind the oil filter, I removed the cap and installed some plumbing to fit the oil pressure sender to (see the Performance Mod thread).

I was surprised how high the oil pressure is for the 3.7L, I was expecting lower oil pressure than I have seen with my past motors, since this motor called for 5W20 oil, I used 10W30 in older motors. Cold Idle 75PSI, warm idle 25PSI, Cold 3000+ rpm 90PSI, Warm 3000+ rpm 80PSI. The oil pressure gauge rarely dropped below 75PSI, except for warm idle.

My previous motors (NOT Commanders), using 10W30 Weight, was typically up around 50-60PSI, with warm idle at 25PSI.
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