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post #1 of 19 (permalink) Old 09-10-2008, 12:30 PM Thread Starter
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Ethanol Woes

I recently filled up at my local shell station for my weekly run and noticed halfway through the week i was getting 3-4mpg less than I usually run. Checked all air/fuel/oil filters and found nothing wrong. When I went back to the same station I noticed a "10% ethanol" sticker on the pump. thinking that may be my problem, since I have never seen the sticker before I drove down the street to a chevron, checked all the pumps for ethanol notices (there were none) and filled up the tank. My mileage went back up to previous #. Just wondering if anyone has had similar problems or if anyone knows where I can find links to which gas companies put max amounts of corn based ethanol in their gas. To my knowledge (based on pumps around town) Shell has the highest.
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post #2 of 19 (permalink) Old 09-10-2008, 12:47 PM
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I have that problem every year in the winter the freaking enviro-nazi's require us to use a blended fuel that contains ethanol which also leaves a white residue.
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post #3 of 19 (permalink) Old 09-10-2008, 01:15 PM
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Here our Mid-grade is only found in 10% ethanol, could run the lower grade regular gas, but it is more expensive, even with the 10% blend still avg about 16-17 mixed driving
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post #4 of 19 (permalink) Old 09-10-2008, 01:31 PM Thread Starter
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I'm in/around Portland, Oregon. Our gas comes pretty mixed. Most stations either don't post the ethanol sticker or haven't added it to the amount required for a sticker posting.
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post #5 of 19 (permalink) Old 09-10-2008, 02:18 PM
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Those stations selling a 10% blend without a posting are in violation of federal regs.
A 10% blend of oxygenate [ethanol] means the fuel actually has oxygen content. That means it has 10% less available BTU,s by volume.
The original idea had nothing to do with going green.
The intent was to make fixed fuel delivery vehicles [carbureted] operate in a leaner condition at the same throttle opening. This was proposed in the mid 80,s.
The oil companys responded by trying to alert the lawmakers that this idea would not be effective with fuel injection on the horizon.
As usual, the government decided this was a ploy and the oil companies were only trying to kill the idea because they didn't want to bear the huge expense in creating a new process added to the refining process.
It was made a requirement, and the oil companies began marketing the blend in the mid 90,s.
Our prices were adjusted accordingly. The product was initially only to be marketed in large cities that were failing to meet E.P.A. air quality standards.
So, in the Chicago area, I've been dealing with this crap for over 13 years.
What the E.P.A. isn't saying: The co-solvents required to keep the alcohol in suspension are likely more hazardous to health than straight gas.
Your fuel mileage will drop by almost the same percentage as the alcohol blend.
This occurs because the front o2 sensors see the lean condition and enrich the fuel mixture to compensate.
You will experience strange failures due to alcohol co-solvents.
The most common is fuel level senders becoming inaccurate.
The co-solvents coat the rheostat on the sender grid.
They are also likely the cause of pre-mature fuel pump failure.
Those of you who have removed spark plugs and found a green coating are looking at burned co-solvents.
If you ever remove a in tank fuel pump you will find a white coating on it and inside the entire fuel tank. More co-solvents.
Oh well, now we think we're being good to the environment by burning a renewable resource.
Well, at whos expense?
Farmers are tickled, but since were burning our crops, instead of eating them, there's less available to eat. Well if you bought groceries lately and noticed the price rise, don't blame fuel delivery expense as the only cause.
The percentage of mileage lost is slightly less with e-85 [85% ethanol] because it has a much higher R.O.N. and your ECM advances the ignition enouph to compensate, just in case you were wondering.
My own tests on the Commander running e-85 resulted in the expected mileage loss.
By calculating fuel as cost per mile though, the lower price didn't pan out, and I was spending more to travel the same distance.
In case you can't tell, I have concluded alcohol is not the answer.

.........Rob
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post #6 of 19 (permalink) Old 09-10-2008, 02:24 PM Thread Starter
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Thank you. That makes things much clearer. The only stations in the Pacific Northwest that I've seen those stickers at are shell stations and a few Chevron stations in Seattle, WA.
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post #7 of 19 (permalink) Old 09-10-2008, 02:25 PM
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Ethenol is supposed to be better for the environment but worse for mpg. In actuallity to convert corn/wood ect to be 1 barrel burnable fuel it takes about 1.5 as much fossil fuel.

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post #8 of 19 (permalink) Old 09-10-2008, 03:41 PM
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Biofuels is an idiotic way to find alternative fuel solutions. This is not the oil for food program the UN was supposed to enforce. Biofuels are partly to blame for the worlds food supply dropping as farmers convert to making biofuels due to governments desperation to make it work by subsidizing the corn.
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post #9 of 19 (permalink) Old 09-10-2008, 04:00 PM
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i had the same problem up in montana.

the pumps do not say how much ethanol is in the gas. but i lost 4+ mpg on my trip. when i use wyoming gasoline i get 4+ mpg better.

the pumps in montana say "MAY CONTAIN ETHANOL" IT DOES AND THEY ARE STILL CHARGING THE REGULAR FUEL PRICE!!!!!!!
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post #10 of 19 (permalink) Old 09-10-2008, 04:04 PM
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Drill here drill now!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Screw the rest of the world, let's use our own oil reserves!
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