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Discussion Starter #1
Last night a friend and I decided to do a little mudding on the trails in my back yard with the commander and his 4 door JK. He hadnt been on the trails in a few years and since it was like 1am and dark outside he wanted me to lead. Well it had rained the past few days here so of course it was muddy as hell back there. About half way down the trail we hit a huge mud hole and I got the commander burried. For some reason whenever I gave it gas the truck made a weird noise comming from the front end and it wouldnt allow me to spin the tires at all. It seemed like the traction control was kicking in along with the ABS. It was so bad that when i tried to go forward or backwards the tires wouldnt even spin to allow me to try to get unstuck. At the time I had the commander in 4 Low with the ESP and traction control off. The ESP OFF light was illuminated on the dash so i know it was totally off. I ended up having to get pulled out from behind by the JK since i couldnt get the commander to move forward or backwards at all.

Have you guys ever experienced these problems before? It just seems that it is totally pointless to ever off road with the commander again if this is something that is normal. I have owned many 4x4s and never experienced anything like this. I just feel like taking off the trail rated badge now....lol
 

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Did you completely disable the ESP system by holding the dash button down for 10 seconds? All 4LO does is disable the traction control, not the ESP system. I always disable the system when offroad, I want to be able to control the truck's movement, not have the computer do it.
 

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It certainly sounds like your wheels were locking in order to try to grab solid ground (which they couldn't find), either the ESP was not 100 % off or your system needs service.
 

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I had a problem where my front-end locked up. You could hear the ABS/ESP "working" Ha! Wheel would barely move, if not at all. kinda scary since I was in a sandy wash and crossing through water. The back wheels worked fine, front wheels digging into the sand stopping me. Couldn't move... Crap!! I put it into 4Low, and powered my way through.
Drove for about ten min with the front making weird noises. Then it went back to normal...?
Took it to Jeep dealer the next day. They replaced a bad "wheel speed sensor". Apparently it wasn't on right and had gotten wet. It was doing its job. Just not the way it was supposed to.
It's been fine for the last couple months. Even going through the water.
Soo.... in closing. Could it be your "wheel speed senors" ?
 

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07JeepXK said:
It seemed like the traction control was kicking in along with the ABS.
ABS will not kick in unless you are appling the brakes.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Yes. When you put the vehicle in neutral and engage 4 Low the traction control light comes on. After that I held down the button for approx. 10 seconds and it displayed ESP OFF on the dash. So yes it was definately disabled. I think i remember someone saying that this still doesnt disable the system completely but i wasnt expecting that to happen. The vehicle was totally useless and I couldn't move at all due to this!
 

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the thing i've learned with QT2 is

when in 4 low, turn the ESP off all the way!

if you are going through really deep crap like mud, keep your momentum up, don't slow down. if you think you might get stuck in the mud, hit the gas.

and i'm looking for lockers that fit the rear end,

so far i have learned the the rear center chunk is a Chrysler 8.25" with a modified ring gear for our commander. its a non-clip with 29 spline shafts that have a diameter of ~1.21".

when i have more time i'll do some more digging or call some companies and see if i can find anything to fit the rear end.
 

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Discussion Starter #9 (Edited)
It sounds like some of you guys are saying this is normal but some are saying that i need to get the vehicle serviced. If i took in the commander how would i explain to them what is happening. They will probablly do what they always do and say either thats how its supposed to be or they didnt find anything wrong with it.

Just out of curiousity how would a rear locker help if i cant get any of the tires to spin do to this problem? Unless i do what you stated and just haul a** through the mud when offroading.
 

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the traction contol is trying to act like a limited slip. but in doing so applies the brakes, and slows you down. it is horrible in snow. you will get stuck! i did. it does not allow the wheels to spin like they should off road.

i think i found a lock right locker that might work. i need to call randy's ring and pinion to check out if it will work in our application. the front and rear differentials are both 8.25" Chrysler center chunks. so if you want there are real lockers for the rear and then there are limited slips for the front. i just need to do some checking.
 

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4.7, you rock! Keep us posted about the lockers.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
4.7commander said:
the front and rear differentials are both 8.25" Chrysler center chunks. so if you want there are real lockers for the rear and then there are limited slips for the front. i just need to do some checking.
Have you ever had both the front and rear differentials apart. The front differential is definately smaller then the rear. There is no way its a 8.25 up front. Anyways a rear locker would be great. I had a powertrax no-slip in the rear of my ranger and it was amazing. They are a little better then the lock rights since they dont make any noise what so ever!
 

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Discussion Starter #13 (Edited)
I was just checking out the Powertrax No-Slip website and they have a locker for a 1997-1998 Grand Cherokee ZJ Chrysler 8.25 29 spline 10 bolt axle. Part #92-0382-2905. Maybe we can look into that and find out if it would work. Id rather have a no-slip then a lock right!

That part # is the same for the 1997-2000 Cherokee XJ too!
 

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i'll try to call monday. maybe some of you other guys could as well. i started my new job and i don't have a lot of time to call.

this all i know about the rear axle.

non-clip, 8.25"Chrysler
1.21" axle shafts
29 spline axles

the only difference between our axle and the 8.25 standard is the non-clip and our jeeps use a larger ring gear. other then that a 8.25" locker should work. i'm dying to find out.
 

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okay, here is what i have found out so far.

the detroit locker 8.25" 29 spline will most likely fit our commanders ring gear.

i talked to a guy at Randy's Ring and Pinion about it. they also sell the lockrights and they should fit as well.

i'm going to call some more places and see what i can find out.
 

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You are going to have to change the name of your Commander to Bullet Proof!
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Maybe someone with a lot of cash flow can order one and be the guinie pig and test it out. If it doesnt fit im sure you could just return it.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
When you say non-clip you are refering to the c-clip correct. As in it doesnt have one. All the axles that i have messed with had c-clips. So how do the axle shafts stay locked in there by the carrier and gears?
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Ahmed is a genious! After reading his thread on turning off the traction control by pulling the ABS Pump fuse I had to go experiment. We pulled the fuse and went back to where i got stuck the night before and went through it with ease. Im going to have to hook up a toggle switch to where i can just flip the switch when ever off roading. Its the fuse under the hood #4 labled ABS Pump. It let me totally spin the wheels without Traction Control kicking in!
 
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