Sport Brakes
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Not many things from the Cherokee match the Commander. I know the aftermarket is scrambling to keep up with jeeper demand.
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120 Posts
there are slotted and crossed drilled rotors for the commander EBC and stillen both make them.
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230 Posts
so, what modifications would be needed to install the SRT8 braking system on the Commander?
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230 Posts
I know that back in the day, I had a Cavalier Z24 that I had all tricked out, and that included custom drilled rotors and kevlar pads. From a seat of the pants feel, I loved them, but i do not know if they really were any better. They just never faded like the cheap stock brakes did.
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696 Posts
I just dropped in on this old thread so I didnt have to start a new one. Picking up Hawk High Performance Street (HPS) brake pads today. I will probably put them on and resurface rotors Thursday. I will let everyone know what I think after the weekend. Anybody else using these?
now when it comes to brakes, there's a few things you should know
less dust is not a good thing
dusty pads like hawk HPS and EBC yellowstuff are a completely different type of dust. This is something that can be sprayed off with a good hose or wiped down with a damp rag. it comes off easy.
less dusty pads like ebc greenstuff, hawk hp+, etc are a little noisier, less dusty but their dust tends to be stickier and pitts things worse. I also don't think they stop all that much better until they get super hot.
I like EBC yellow stuff and hawk HPS myself. the hawk superduty truck pads are good too.
both trusted companies.
as for rotors, you have 4 choices
powerslot cryo
EBC slotted
brembo blank
OEM/napa AE or UP
edit: I've done brakes on everything from a fleet of ambulances (maxed GVWs run hard 24 hours a day) to tundras (worst brakes EVER, about as bad as the old ZJ)
Anyone who gets a "shimmy" or "shudder" with new rotors needs to have their hubs machined. I've learned more times than not if you buy quality parts, it's the OEM ones that sometimes are out of spec. a quick pass with an on car digital lathe makes quick work of it and are at most tire shops.
less dust is not a good thing
dusty pads like hawk HPS and EBC yellowstuff are a completely different type of dust. This is something that can be sprayed off with a good hose or wiped down with a damp rag. it comes off easy.
less dusty pads like ebc greenstuff, hawk hp+, etc are a little noisier, less dusty but their dust tends to be stickier and pitts things worse. I also don't think they stop all that much better until they get super hot.
I like EBC yellow stuff and hawk HPS myself. the hawk superduty truck pads are good too.
both trusted companies.
as for rotors, you have 4 choices
powerslot cryo
EBC slotted
brembo blank
OEM/napa AE or UP
edit: I've done brakes on everything from a fleet of ambulances (maxed GVWs run hard 24 hours a day) to tundras (worst brakes EVER, about as bad as the old ZJ)
Anyone who gets a "shimmy" or "shudder" with new rotors needs to have their hubs machined. I've learned more times than not if you buy quality parts, it's the OEM ones that sometimes are out of spec. a quick pass with an on car digital lathe makes quick work of it and are at most tire shops.
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3,037 Posts
This is the most effective thing I've seen posted yet in this thread.
Yea, generally with Brakes, bigger is better. That is, in size of the rotors and pads, NOT, more of something is better, sometimes its worse.
Cross drilled and slotted rotors? Has anyone shown they work on a Commander better than OEM rotors? Most of the time, these things sell for looks only, and half the time, they are cheaply made and actually perform and last worse than OEM direct replacement rotors, because half the time, they are just cheap OEM direct replacement rotors that are drilled and machined. Proper drilled and/or slotted rotors are designed as such, and add mass (the most important thing in a rotor) at the right places to make up for the loss of mass in the holes and slots that also weaken and stress the rotors. Really good drilled rotors are cast with the holes already in them. Just drilling a hole in a rotor will create stress risers that will causes cracks, they have to be stress releived.
One of the Porchse racing teams would take the OEM drilled and slotted rotors off their new cars from Porchse and replace them with solid disc rotors and got better braking performance.
It varies from vehicle to vehicle and the conditions, so sometimes they are better, sometimes they are worse.
Drilled and Slotted Rotors are designed to counter out gassing of the pads and help cooling in racing where your braking every few seconds and heating up the pads and rotors really hot. If your using your brakes in a way they aren't heating up to the point that a few holes speed up cooling (in most cases it does NOT until the rotor is glowing red) and the pads don't out gas, like driving on the street and off-road, what are those holes and slots doing for you, other than making the rotor weaker and reducing the amount of friction surface for the pads?
As well, a lot of "RACE" brake pads, are designed to work in a race, being used heavily ever few seconds where the brakes are red hot the whole race. They are designed to work properly after they are already hot. Put a set of "RACE" pads on a street vehicle, and likely your brake performance will be worse, until you start driving like a maniac for 5 minutes to get the pads all heated up.
*A good set of aftermarket performance pads DESIGNED FOR THE STREET, is your quickest and cheapest way of improving brake performance, and the most likely to actually do it.
*A whole new aftermarket set of brakes, that are bigger, sure, thats likely to work, provided the suspension and chassis can handle it. Its really expensive also.
*CrossDrilled and/or Slotted Rotors? Its possible they may work, but unlikely, unless your driving your Jeep like a race car on the street, good chance you're just throwing your money away, and if they do anything, they'll perform worse or crack and need to be replaced a lot sooner.
I could be wrong on the Drilled/Slotted Rotors for a Commander on the Street and Off Road, cause there are a lot factors that go into it. But IMO, I wouldn't even try it, unless I have some real data proving me wrong, and proving they do actually make a difference on a Commander in the way it is typically driven.
Someone mentioned brake fade, and if the Commanders Brakes are really too small for its weight, that might be a problem. But the holes and slots really don't do that much for cooling, and even then, its for inbetween braking NOT during braking. The rotors act like heat sinks, if they get too hot, you need more iron mass to absorb more heat. Again skeptical, but maybe someone could prove me wrong. I bet a good set of aftermarket performance pads designed for the street would fight fad better than drilled/slotted rotors.
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1,993 Posts
I agree with most of the stuff posted by Mongo. The only issue I have ever had with my brakes is in 4LO. Especially if I am on any type of down hill slope I have to stand on my brakes to keep my stopped. Not sure what modifications can help this maybe bigger calipers or something IDK. But for a daily driver the brakes are good and I don't see a need to help get rid of heat can't imagine driving hard enough on the street to cause break fade either.
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6,309 Posts
I have the same problem in 4 low. Honestly though, there is nothing you can do about that. Our vehicles have so much torque and when you put it in low that multiplies. I just put it in 1st when going down hill since thats really the only thing we can do to help out.
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3,037 Posts
Thats exactly what I was thinking, with all the torque multiplication that 4Low does, its hard to overcome the idle torque on the motor with the brakes. Use engine braking by downshifting. I'm guessing you could slip it to neutral if you want to stay at a stop, BUT, NOT having used 4Low much at all (don't currently have a vehicle with it), I don't know how practical that is.
BTW, I read an article, the most common way brake rotors warp is to stand on the brakes with the most force possible when they are really hot and at a stop or low speed. Sounds like the exact scenario your describing above.
Unfortunately, Warped Rotors is a bad term, people think the rotor warps like a piece of sheet metal or wood, which if it does that, its really called tulipping. When rotors warp, in reality, the metal is deformed, and quite often its pinched, i.e. the surface of the disc varies because one side of the rotor got pinched down narrower by the caliper and pads. You get the rotors hot enough, the metal softens a bit, then you squeeze the soften metal with the Hydrualic Press like force of the caliper with the rotor stopped or barely moving, you actually pinch the metal down and deform it slightly, and create a variation in the surface of the rotor, that causes the pedal to vibrate.
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54 Posts
I know this thread is a little old, but I was doing some searching on a site today & just happened to run across this.
From the web site.
"When you need something tougher than a Power Slot rotor, but you’re not quite ready for a big brake kit, try our new Power Slot Cryo rotors. We’ve invested in the latest state-of-the-art equipment to offer cryogenic treatment on our Power Slot rotor line.
Deep cryogenic treatment is a one-time process that permanently improves the performance and service life of metals from brake rotors and engine parts, to machine tools and gear sets. Using a proprietary computer-controlled process, the metal is cooled gradually to -300°F and then slowly returned to room temperature and heat-cycled as the final step. Although not apparent to the naked eye, the improvements to the rotor are significant. The cryogenic treatment process redistributes residual stress in the rotor giving it an extra level of protection against warping."
Links
Cryo rotor treatment page
Powerslot.com Main Page
Place I ran across this info
From the web site.
"When you need something tougher than a Power Slot rotor, but you’re not quite ready for a big brake kit, try our new Power Slot Cryo rotors. We’ve invested in the latest state-of-the-art equipment to offer cryogenic treatment on our Power Slot rotor line.
Deep cryogenic treatment is a one-time process that permanently improves the performance and service life of metals from brake rotors and engine parts, to machine tools and gear sets. Using a proprietary computer-controlled process, the metal is cooled gradually to -300°F and then slowly returned to room temperature and heat-cycled as the final step. Although not apparent to the naked eye, the improvements to the rotor are significant. The cryogenic treatment process redistributes residual stress in the rotor giving it an extra level of protection against warping."
Links
Cryo rotor treatment page
Powerslot.com Main Page
Place I ran across this info
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195 Posts
Interesting application - here is some additional info if interested
http://www.metalscience.com/techinfo_ASM.php
I am not sure how much "longer lasting or more durable" rotors would be for this application. The case study shows a 560% improvement in abrasive wear, so there might be something to this.
http://www.metalscience.com/techinfo_ASM.php
I am not sure how much "longer lasting or more durable" rotors would be for this application. The case study shows a 560% improvement in abrasive wear, so there might be something to this.
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